Temat: Characteristics of Poles and the place of Poland in Europe
ilter K.:
I can see and feel your naive quality as a nation, and nothing is wrong with it.
Something about the thought of "we are not right"...
I feel something like: "Some stupid Pole might have done it, I'm sure. Unfortunately, we have many idiots" when something goes wrong. You do it to yourself. And I don't know why, you think, you are the only nation does this. Which is, wrong, my friend.
This is what I feel when a Pole talks about Poland. I find this idea wrong, and thinking, that won't help matters.
I don't fully understand this part. You mean we are not the only nation who does things ourself or we are not the only nation who makes things wrong?
But what I see also is, you have such beliefs like:
- West won't accept you as friends whatever you do
- Poles don't fit into the picture
- There's no friends to Poles
- Poland is kind of alone, and its always been that way.
I won't tell you what is the reason. It's even in our literature icons, all this martyrology. I believe it's build up through the centuries and now simply is. And I don't like it and that is what I'm talking about, we feel bad. But as I said, this unites us as a nation. Because "we can make it besides how bad it is!". That's how it works I think. And maybe that's why it resisted for so long, because it actually has a positive impact.
What makes you believe that you are soooo different than a French?
I find the only explanation to this as, the unlucky history of Poland and economical power. Nothing else.
Well and you say we are not different? That Italians and Britons are similar? That Slavic people and Scandinavians are similar? That Turks are same as Swedes? I mean come on, we simply are different. I saw it personally, we have a different attitudes for let's say free time spending or partying as French. That is enough because in Poland socializing is very important and "honesty" (often seen as being drunk) plays a big role. If we don't see it in other nations we don't trust. And I see it only in other Slavic ones and as I said previously, Italians (where's Jarek?! ;D ).
Poland almost never had great support from its neighbours. You had serious wars. Now, what do you expect from west, although sometimes they clearly pat your back and support you in a way.
Do you think there's a secret plan to destroy you? No. That could only be a remote theory by some very old people, I guess.
Ha, here is the point!!!! We don't wan't no help. That is the national proud. It is kind of wierd here but I believe we are really patriotic despite the fact we keep saying that we don't like ourselves. (It starts to dissapear nowdays though, so we actually start to be, ekhem, civilized.)
I'll tell you a story. Once on a wedding celebration party (the traditional, Polish-way one) there was a Dutch husband of the bride's best girlfriend. The connection doesn't really matter, the point is he was Dutch. We were talking and it turned out that he has plenty of land around the place (it's rather attractive, there is a lake and so on). Actually he bought it on his mother in law simply giving her money because law wouldn't allow a foreginer to buy that ammounts of land. What was surprising him most though was the fact, that people didn't like him. He was organizing different aids like gathering used clothes in Holland and giving it away as gifts on holidays and so on. He was surprised that he is helping the people, is giving im a job, takes them out of their misery and they don't appreciate it.
Now who really get's what is the story about? (I know you do Ilter, I'm asking people from the West ;) ).
And from my talks with many other Poles who visited the West that is the general attitude. West treats us as poor, bit Russian country who needs a noble help. And in my opinion that is the thing that should change, not our level of "civilization".
So first thing. We don't want any help because we are a proud nation and have nothing to be ashamed of. Don't get tricked by what we say. We keep saying that we are bad but really hate when someone else does this.
(And one more really important thing. The fact my post sounds really emotional is because of my English skills and problems with showing emotions in a proper way. I treat this discussion as a good way of English training, not a holly war, really :) )
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