Temat: Football Hooliganism Polish Style
Marek Szpitun:
warren:
I'll make a long post on this subject.
...
Wow, big thanks for this long post Warren. It's really interesting.
It's difficult to post about these things objectively.
People seem to want to either want to play down racism, violence and so on, sweep it under the carpet, or else to glamorise and sensationalise it.
Anyway, if you want to know how racist and violent British football crowds are, or rather were, (I don't go any more to matches in the U.K.), I'll try and answer honestly. I've probably been to most league grounds in the U.K., generally watching Portsmouth (Pompey), who at that time had something of a reputation for hooliganism.
The first thing I'd say is that many if not most 'hooligans' tend to be bullshitters and cowards. There's been a lot written about so-called hooligan 'firms' in the U.K., and much if not most of it is hyperbolic rubbish. The most ridiculous books of this genre are that of the Yank Bill Burford 'Among the thugs', and various ridiculous fairy tales written by the pathetic and idiotic Brimson brothers. There have also been some equally cringe-worthy films, 'Green Street Hooligans' starring the hobbit having been made for a gullible American and continental audience.
Pompey had a long standing off the field rivalry with Millwall, generally regarded as the team with the 'hardest' supporters in the U.K.. I remember the first Pompey Millwall match I attended in about 1980. The atmosphere was very different to what you would get at an English football match today. There was little effective segregation of supporters at that time, and the match was held up for 15 minutes when fighting spilled onto the pitch. What impressed me was one or two Millwall headcases who would steam into Pompey
on their own. Later I asked a hardcore Millwall fan why anyone would do that. He told me they would do it for a bet.
I think people were to a degree different then. Working class people had genuine manual jobs in the docks or the dockyard. They were 'tougher' than their fat modern counterparts. If the local hardcases wanted to have a scrap they were left to get on with it. No-one used weapons, and no-one got killed.
These were 'the bad days' of football violence. I would say that at most away games some violent incident would occur, usually on the way to or from the ground, although sometimes Pompey would infiltrate the home ends of the teams they were playing.
Of course no-one who didn't want to get involved would usually be bothered by hooligans. Even at this time the vast majority going to the football were ordinary fans rather than hooligans.
In the eighties the police organisation became more sophisticated, fans were 'caged', and violence was reduced. With increased police sophistication, the hooligans also became more organised, sometimes organising 'ambushes' miles from the actual ground.
About racism, Pompey had a reputation for having some of the most racist fans. Unlike most London teams, we never had any black support. Monkey chants were heard at matches, and I can remember bananas being thrown at black players. I've also seen racial attacks on blacks at away matches, and 'seig-heiling' by a tiny minority.
How is it today? I'm being honest here. The last time I saw Pompey the fences had been taken down, the away supporters mixed with the home supporters without any problems, there was no racist or aggressive chanting. Nothing. Even for the visit of Millwall. The hooligans are now fat, balding and middle-aged, and the youngsters too lazy and apathetic to fight.
I'm pretty sure that in any confrontation between English and Polish hooligans, the English would come off worse.
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