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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

Inverse snobbery in the U.K..

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/aleksandra_lojekma...

All I can say is - thank God I'm a Brit.

I'd far rather run round Krakow naked than be a bird-brained faux-intellectual.
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

All I can say - lucky you, Warren.

Managed to read about one third of it. That's V.D. (Verbal Diarrhoea). Apologies to the Lady.
Please don't ask me why I think so.
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

You don't have to agree, Wendy.
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

Nor do I have to disagree, or do I?

The thing is full of dangerous overgeneralizations.I am a Pole and she is writing about my past so it's not extremely difficult to draw conclusions about the value of the text and its author.
Total lack of responsibility for words.
You can take almost any single sentence she writes and show how false and irresponsible for words she is.
And what a comparative study of two nations!
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

There's some truth in her generalisations.

But I'd far rather see the world in the way that I do than the way that she, (and some others on GL), does.
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

Would be interesting to see examples of such truths.
You don't mean the very first sentence, do you? Maybe I miss some truths about your country, anything she says about Poland is rubbish.
What does she base her truths on?

To give you just this one example: She says that even British intellectuals fell in love with communism. Was it really love, or maybe only fascination. Who does she mean? I might know this and that but the reader must know exactly why she says so and whom she means. Was, for example, G. Wells in love, fascinated or just interested in communism? This is only a detail in the text.
The picture of Polish teachers 'extracting' information out of their pupils - no commments!

Honestly, I don't feel like thinking about the text any longer.
Let us wait and see if other people in the group disagree with you.Wendy Tweed edytował(a) ten post dnia 27.03.08 o godzinie 03:00
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

I can't comment on the subject matter, but she does kinda make things interesting from time to time. So I'm glad we have her.Joj Y. edytował(a) ten post dnia 27.03.08 o godzinie 04:37
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

BratislavaBilly's reply to her (on the Guardian page) is interesting. He (or she) seems to be quite familiar with the country.
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

Steven H.:
BratislavaBilly's reply to her (on the Guardian page) is interesting. He (or she) seems to be quite familiar with the country.

My opinions are very similar to his.

I believe the more one is familiar with Poland, the less patience one has for pani Ola type verbal diarrhoea.

To many Guardian readers pani Ola's articles are interesting as 'a Martian writes' would be interesting; having never set foot in a Polish institute of higher education they would have absolutely no idea where her faux-intellectualism was coming from. Personally, having had contact with the Polish chattering classes, I believe 'mooning' one of their most ridiculous representatives would be the most appropriate responsewarren whitmore edytował(a) ten post dnia 27.03.08 o godzinie 08:26
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

Wendy Tweed:
Would be interesting to see examples of such truths.

It's true that there is a difference in mentality towards faux intellectual snobbery in Poland and the U.K..

In Poland it's tolerated and even lauded, whereas in the U.K. no-one is afraid to identify it for what it is.
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

Joj Y.:
I can't comment on the subject matter, but she does kinda make things interesting from time to time. So I'm glad we have her.Joj Y. edytował(a) ten post dnia 27.03.08 o godzinie 04:37

Even tho' I can't stand the woman, I'd agree with you.
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

Steven H.:
BratislavaBilly's reply to her (on the Guardian page) is interesting. He (or she) seems to be quite familiar with the country.

Which country? ;)
Yeah, he/she seems to be more familiar with reality than the author who's a sociologist (sic!)
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

"it is worth noting that during communism education was in a very poor state, contrary to what people like to say nowadays. It was never free, because what few books were available in officially censored translation were very expensive and hard to get. Intellectuals were either persecuted or corrupt. At primary school, every child was asked to declare their origin; intelligentsia or working class. Children from the former strata received harsher treatment during most lessons, especially in history - their answers were studied carefully by zealous teachers, eager to sniff out signs of opposition being poured into their young minds by parents back home. Working-class children were, strangely enough, free from this harassment. I remember being very diligently and publicly interrogated by my teacher about solidarity, to the great alarm of my mother. Fortunately, being at the time deeply in love with a classmate, I was not even remotely interested in my parents' rare conversational switches from family rows to political discussions.

We were taught that all people were equal, but there were clear divisions between "thinkers" and "followers". Bookworms were laughed at, and it was much safer to be a light-hearted fool. In schools, submission, not curiosity, was a highly valued virtue. Thinkers were out, doers were in."

If I could, I'd take this entire paragraph, reprint it 100 times and make her eat it. I actually feel bad for her. Her so called observations are based on behavioral patterns of a deviant. The way she describes Brits and their culture, one may think that she hangs out at some cut throat pubs, or the episode of 90210... Either one will leave you dead, or brain dead. Now, as per this entire description of what school was like, isn't this exactly what every school is like? Clicks of geeks and clicks of cool kids, thugs and bullies etc...
She was deeply in love with her classmate and this is the reason for her not paying attention to what was happening around her? You mean she missed the whole Cultural Revolution because she had a penis on her mind? Shows how DEEP her mental capability of processing outside stimuli is. Wow... what a total crock of shit. I only made it to the end of that paragraph.. Really... I have a weak stomach. Maybe she's still in love with her class mate and simply needs a good shag to get her thought patterns back on track. Unreal. It's funny, because I do like The Guardian and have been a reader for quite some time now, yet not until Warren brought this abomination out of it's cave had I any idea that she existed. Be gone witch! Salem's calling!
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

If the Communists did actually persecute Polish intellectuals, after reading pani Ola's articles, I am drawn to the inescapable conclusion that thay may well have been right to have done so.warren whitmore edytował(a) ten post dnia 27.03.08 o godzinie 13:15
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

warren whitmore:
If the Communists did actually persecute Polish intellectuals, after reading pani Ola's articles, I am drawn to the inescapable conclusion that thay may well have been right to have done so.

I can give you an example from my childhood. I will not sit here and deny that we were being force fed bull shit history lessons, because that was the daily dose of reality for all students. My family roots go pretty far back into Polish and Lithuanian history I learned history from my parents and my grandparents. Often enough it absolutely contradicted everything that my teacher spoke of in school. By the time I was 14 years old, my little mouth was writing out checks that my poor mom couldn't cash, so she was a frequent visitor at my school. One instance that I recall clear as day was when we discussed Margrabia Wielopolski in class (who was a great trader to the Polish people and committed some heinous acts in his time, like selling his "chlopow" to the Russian army to fight against their own, to name just one). We were being taught that he was a noble man and a "righteous dude". I disagreed with the teacher and brought forth those facts. To make the long story short - I ended up with 5 "2"s (2 at the time was the lowest grade possible) and I wasn't even being tested, I simply disagreed, said something that did not agree with the line of teaching and failed to keep my mouth shut. My poor mom had to come back and revisit walls of my school, just to sit there and listen to a "robot" tell her about raising her kids the right way.Rafal Wolk edytował(a) ten post dnia 27.03.08 o godzinie 13:33
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

I wsn't being entirely serious, Rafal.
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Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

warren whitmore:
I wsn't being entirely serious, Rafal.

I know... I do get sarcasm. It was just an example of what it was like. Not so much as Pani Ola described in her masterpiece. Students were pretty well aware of what was happening, unless they were the poor kids of some communist manifesto waving dip shit. We would openly talk and criticize government and it's actions daily in school. At that age, you didn't really care much about possible consequences. I myself with few students formed a small group that would meet up after school and our "thing" was to discuss political issues that we didn't quite understand just yet, but we tried very hard hahaha... we weren't alone either. I think Pani Ola had her head so far up her ass during that time, that she simply didn't realize that "Winds of change" was something more than just a bad song of a washed up German hair band.
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Jon M.

Jon M. Technical/Offshore
English,
petrochemicals

Temat: Pani Ola's latest article:

Steven H.:
BratislavaBilly's reply to her (on the Guardian page) is interesting. He (or she) seems to be quite familiar with the country.


He does seem perceptive. Accurate too.

That Pani Ola does certainly seem to have a kind of verbal (literary?) diarrhoea. It looks like she's being paid per column inch, though it seeems to be in the section of their website where people don't get paid at all. Must have time on her hands.Jon M. edytował(a) ten post dnia 27.03.08 o godzinie 20:11
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