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Steve Jones

Steve Jones Business English
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Assuming that the championship will actually be held in Poland and that someone eventually manages to organise the construction of a stadium and a couple of roads (and that's a major assumption)... IS Poland too racist for the Euro 2012?

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x500y1_bbc-inside-spo...
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Thanks for posting this Steve.

As someone who has been to 200+ Polish league games, I would have to say 'yes'.
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Łukasz G.

Łukasz G. Senior Technical
Sales Manager w
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

I am deeply shocked, that is why I hate football in general!

On the other hand, as one of those people said (in Polish) it does not happen on National level Football, so I think there is nothing to worry about really.

It is only dumb arse uneducated fanatics, that behave in such way!

I am in deep pain that in a country like POLAND, there are so many neo-fascists where there should be NONE!
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Steve Jones

Steve Jones Business English
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

I was also shocked by the footage, having never been to a football match here. I think that what's shown doesn't reflect Poland on the whole, just a small sub-culture who are overtly racist.

However, I have noticed larger amounts of latent racism which, I suppose underpins what's shown in the report.
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Ilter K.

Ilter K. Business Developer,
Music Producer, AVID
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

I don't have to see or hear any news about it.
This country is not racist. Maybe some of its people are.
I think France is more racist than Poland.
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

I don't think that the situation is any worst than any other given predominantly white country. A google search for Polish white supremacy groups turns out only couple sites, but when you make that an English search (British or American) your hits just "keep on coming". In US football aka soccer is a sport that mainly attracts families with kids and foreigners, there is no culture that is related to it just yet, you don't get to see the neo nazis or the white supremacy groups out in the open, but it doesn't mean that they do not exist. KKK claims to be a (and I quote):"We are just simply Christian people defending the Christian way of life".
This quote taken from an FBI report - "an average of 191,000 hate crime incidents involving one or more victims occurred annually."
Here you have some statistics regarding Hate Crimes in the UK:

Nationally, in 2006-07, police reported 5,619 hate crimes in which someone was injured, 4,350 hate crimes without injury, and 28,485 cases of racially or religiously motivated harassment.

There were also 3,565 cases of criminal damage related to hate crimes.

The typical hate offender is a young white male (most homophobic offenders are aged 16-20, and most race hate offenders under 30).

The majority of hate crimes happen near to the victim's home while they are going about their daily business, and an offence is most likely to be committed between 3pm and midnight.

Most hate criminals live in the same neighbourhood as their victims.

(source Crime in England and Wales 2006-07)

Here is an article I found online regarding how Poland compares to other EU members it is in Polish:

http://www.polskapartianarodowa.org/tp/index.php?optio...Rafal Wolk edytował(a) ten post dnia 09.04.08 o godzinie 14:10
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Steve Jones

Steve Jones Business English
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

>Here is an article I found online regarding how Poland compares to
other EU members it is in Polish:

http://www.polskapartianarodowa.org/tp/index.php?optio...Rafal Wolk edytował(a) ten post dnia 09.04.08 o godzinie 14:10

The article provides two interesting statistics: the percentage of crime in Poland with a racist element is 2,3% whereas in England it is 4,3%. At first glace it would appear that England therefore is more racist. However, given the large numbers of immigrants and therefore opportunity for racist crime in England compared with the virtually all-white all-catholic Poland, and I'm startled that there is so much race related crime in Poland. This is astonishing.
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

The article provides two interesting statistics: the percentage of crime in Poland with a racist element is 2,3% whereas in England it is 4,3%. At first glace it would appear that England therefore is more racist. However, given the large numbers of immigrants and therefore opportunity for racist crime in England compared with the virtually all-white all-catholic Poland, and I'm startled that there is so much race related crime in Poland. This is astonishing.

Yes, and what's the percentage of non-whites living in Poland? Something like 0.1%, whilst in the UK it is probably closer to 10%.

Though neo-Nazis exist everywhere, I think that the point is that in Poland the subculture is very visible in and around football, something which isn't the case any more in the UK. This is, after all, a football tournament.

In the end though I'm not sure that there will be that many problems. The crowds going to the games will be so big and the police presence so large, and the tickets so expensive..... I think that this fringe element will not really be able to operate during the tournament.
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Steve Jones:
>Here is an article I found online regarding how Poland compares to
other EU members it is in Polish:

http://www.polskapartianarodowa.org/tp/index.php?optio...Rafal Wolk edytował(a) ten post dnia 09.04.08 o godzinie 14:10

The article provides two interesting statistics: the percentage of crime in Poland with a racist element is 2,3% whereas in England it is 4,3%. At first glace it would appear that England therefore is more racist. However, given the large numbers of immigrants and therefore opportunity for racist crime in England compared with the virtually all-white all-catholic Poland, and I'm startled that there is so much race related crime in Poland. This is astonishing.

There are also 20 million more people living in the UK than Poland (registered).
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Teresa L.

Teresa L. HR Business Partner

Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

hey,
I was really shocked when I saw this..
I do like watching the football games, but I've never seen that kind of problem.
What a shame that the Polish football goverment didn't put the ban on rasis "fans" and they stil can go without any problem into tribunes with rasist flags and so on..
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

In the UK the surveillance and the strict rules that apply during football matches are pretty much what makes those games safe and keeps unwanted element out. Polish police is... well to say the least under funded and can not afford such actions. The violence during UK games has dropped dramatically during the past 7 years due to applied strategies. Another thing that can't be overlooked is how organized and well established UK firms are and how much history is behind them while Polish hooligans are simply just that hooligans. Either way, all those swastika wearing morons should be locked up in some middle eastern prisons. Never understood the mentality behind that whole movement, they would have been the first ones to be executed under that regime. Someone I used to work with once said "Ignorance never sleeps".
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Rafal Wolk:
Steve Jones:
>Here is an article I found online regarding how Poland compares to
other EU members it is in Polish:

http://www.polskapartianarodowa.org/tp/index.php?optio...

The article provides two interesting statistics: the percentage of crime in Poland with a racist element is 2,3% whereas in England it is 4,3%.

There are also 20 million more people living in the UK than Poland (registered).

But what is your point?
I agree with you though that this kind of person probably wouldn't have past the strict tests of what makes a superior person, and would have sent to a labour camp or soap factory rather quickly. Rather ironic really?

Another rather ironic thing (if it is irony???) is that the guy said "In four years you can build a lot of road and stadia..." He obviously hasn't done too much research on Poland ;)Steven H. edytował(a) ten post dnia 09.04.08 o godzinie 21:22
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

My point was
2.6% in Poland = 1040000
4.3% in UK = 2150000

It's like comparing US unemployment (4.8%) with Polish (14.9%)
yet when you look at the actual numbers behind these stats it paints a completely different picture.

Now when you take into the consideration the rate of minorities living in the UK vs those living in Poland, density of population and the fact that majority of racial or hate crimes in general go unreported...
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Rafal Wolk:
My point was
2.6% in Poland = 1040000
4.3% in UK = 2150000

Steve commented on the percentage of crime being race-related, not the percentage of the population.
I think he was suggesting that since the percentage of the population that is non-white in Poland is miniscule, then the number of race-related crimes ought to be miniscule.

BTW, you are a bit too negative with Polish unemployment. It is now around 11% and heading south. In the major cities it is typically about 4%. This is why I think you would have no problems finding other types of jobs if you decided against teaching English in the end.
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Steve Jones

Steve Jones Business English
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Steven H.:
Rafal Wolk:
My point was
2.6% in Poland = 1040000
4.3% in UK = 2150000

Steve commented on the percentage of crime being race-related, not the percentage of the population.
I think he was suggesting that since the percentage of the population that is non-white in Poland is miniscule, then the number of race-related crimes ought to be miniscule.

Thanks, Steve - that was exactly my point! Someone understands me at last! Hurray:)))
BTW, you are a bit too negative with Polish unemployment. It is now around 11% and heading south. In the major cities it is typically about 4%. This is why I think you would have no problems finding other types of jobs if you decided against teaching English in the end.

Yeah - and 4% unemployment is round about the "natural" unemployment level, as in the percentage that will always be out of work/ unwilling or incapable, so the situation in Polish cities is rosey, I'd say.

Is it?
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Yeah - and 4% unemployment is round about the "natural" unemployment level, as in the percentage that will always be out of work/ unwilling or incapable, so the situation in Polish cities is rosey, I'd say.

Is it?


I know that waiting-on isn't something that everyone wants to do, and I know that salaries are still relatively low (though the PLN is able to buy more and more when compared with other currencies) but there are so many shops and restaurants with notices in their windows, and I have noticed that the amount of CVs that we receive when advertising for staff has plummeted during the 28 months since I first looked for someone.
As you say, it largely a case of people refusing work rather than companies refusing people, plus a core element of unemployable individuals.
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Despite what I saw on the video, I don't expect too much trouble from racism. I reckon that this neo-Nazism is something of a hobby for these individuals who are rather lost in life, and by chance they go to domestic football matches. I think that if they are patriotic (which presumably they are) they wouldn't want Poland to be shamed, and as a result they will behave (not that most of them will be able to afford to get into Euro 2012 games anyway)? Was England shamed at Euro 1996? I don't think so.

Plus I reckon that unless tourists deciding to go wandering around distant housing districts in the suburbs of cities at night, they'll be safe. They'll be safe in numbers and they will be hanging around in visible parts of busy city centres.Steven H. edytował(a) ten post dnia 10.04.08 o godzinie 13:31
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

sorry, my fault... slight misunderstanding, have been home sick, may not be the sharpest light bulb in the drawer right now.
The unemployment numbers I found available on the net, if you google "unemployment rates Poland" it will be the top hit... I guess it just proves how reliable statistics are. 4%? Wow I am nicely surprised! I figured that it couldn't be that bad, but it's hard to judge when you are not there.
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

The funny thing is that with the EU's 'harmonised' measure of unemployment the level in Poland is something like 9%, and there are now 2 countries with worse levels. Things have really turned around in Poland during the last 3 years and it isn't simply that people have left the country. A lot of new jobs have been created too.
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Temat: Poland - Too racist for the Euro 2012

Fuck 'em. I would be more worried about, and spend more preventions on the morbidity and mortality from traffic accidents related to that event.

How to drive. Those xenophobes will weed themselves out.Joj Y. edytował(a) ten post dnia 10.04.08 o godzinie 19:50
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